How to Land Big Sponsorship Deals Even If You Are Starting Out Ft. Justin Moore.

[00:00:00] Hey, and welcome back to Content Is Profit. This is Luis, half of the BIZBROS, and I'm welcoming you to this incredible start of 2025 in the 10-episode series on where we go all the way from frameworks to how to monetize your content in a very specific way, even how to outrun Google or how to land your dream sponsors.

[00:00:20] So I think these 10 episodes are going to really help you. If you haven't listened to any of the others, go back, and they start on January 3rd all the way to January 12th. So super excited to share this with you. Enjoy.

[00:00:33] Hey, I'm Luis. And I'm Luis. And you're listening to the Content Is Profit podcast.

[00:00:44] Today's guest is the creator wizard himself, the godfather of sponsorships. Someone who has done over 4 million smackaroos in sponsorships and sent over 550 sponsorship invoices for his own personal business.

[00:01:02] I just imagined the email going, invoice, invoice, invoice, invoice, invoice, invoice.

[00:01:08] Not to mention that he's as cool as they come. He used to be in a metalcore band, classically trained in opera, and of course, hosts a podcast, and he's an awesome dad. Let's go.

[00:01:20] We might or might not ask him to sing on this podcast, but please welcome the Pavarotti of content creators, the creator wisdom himself, Justin Moore.

[00:01:32] Woo-hoo! What's up, Justin?

[00:01:35] What is going on, guys? That was probably the best intro. I need you guys to follow me around and go speak on stages or something. You guys are like the best hype people.

[00:01:44] Justin, welcome to Content Is Profit. We're so excited to have you, man. I've been following your content for a little bit.

[00:01:49] The thing that hooked me was your hooks. Your hooks were absolutely incredible.

[00:01:55] So, first of all, I'm a little bit curious. You say you started as a creator in 2009.

[00:01:59] Seven years ago, you became a full-time creator. What transitioned there? What was that change?

[00:02:06] Because from 2009 to seven years ago, I'm not going to do the math right here, you know.

[00:02:10] But, you know, that's quite a while that it sounds like you stay persistent and consistent working on your content to be able to do that transition.

[00:02:20] Yeah, so it's actually been almost 10 years that I've been doing it full-time, actually.

[00:02:23] Wow.

[00:02:24] So, yeah, even longer. And my wife has been doing it full-time for 12 years.

[00:02:28] And actually, I give full credit to her because she was actually the one who started her channel initially, her YouTube channel early on.

[00:02:34] But back in the day, I was in medical devices. I'm actually an engineer by my background.

[00:02:38] And it was actually my wife who started tinkering with uploading videos on YouTube way back in 2009.

[00:02:44] And I was kind of behind the scenes. I wasn't in front of the camera.

[00:02:49] But she had kind of tapped me to ask for help when brands started coming and knocking on her door.

[00:02:55] Because initially, she had a kind of beauty and cosmetics channel where she was talking about makeup and beauty products, hair care, that kind of thing.

[00:03:01] And back in the day, brands were not really paying influencers, creators.

[00:03:07] It was like, hey, here's this free hair curler or blow dryer or something.

[00:03:12] And she was like, yes, this is amazing.

[00:03:14] It's like, you know, because we were super, you know, like we were young.

[00:03:17] We didn't have a ton of money.

[00:03:18] And so free stuff was amazing, right?

[00:03:21] And so it was when that first brand offered to compensate her.

[00:03:25] That was when we were like, whoa, hold on a second here.

[00:03:28] This is crazy.

[00:03:28] Like they were offering to actually pay her money to talk about their brand on her channel.

[00:03:32] And so that's when I was like, by this time, I was like getting my MBA at night.

[00:03:36] And so I was like, Mr. MBA, I can read this contract.

[00:03:39] Let me help negotiate.

[00:03:40] I have no idea.

[00:03:41] No idea what we were doing, right?

[00:03:43] And not only did we not have any idea what we were doing, but no one in our life, our friends, our family, we didn't know anyone else who was really doing this.

[00:03:52] You know, back, you know, this was 2009 or by this time, probably 2010, 2011.

[00:03:57] And so we just bumbled our way through it, guys.

[00:04:00] Like we made every mistake in the book.

[00:04:02] You know, we, oh, 100 bucks.

[00:04:04] Yeah, that sounds like a good amount.

[00:04:05] You know, 200, 500 bucks.

[00:04:07] Yeah, sure.

[00:04:07] It sounds good, right?

[00:04:08] Sign away broadcast TV rights.

[00:04:10] Like literally this happened.

[00:04:11] We turned on the TV one day and we saw my wife was in a commercial, like a TV commercial.

[00:04:17] And we were like, we like looked at each other.

[00:04:19] Like, did we grant the brand the rights to do that?

[00:04:21] Looked at the contract.

[00:04:21] Sure enough.

[00:04:22] You know, and this is for free stuff.

[00:04:24] This is not even for money, right?

[00:04:25] And so honestly, like this is really, we learned everything trial by fire, just like making every mistake in the book.

[00:04:34] You know, we ultimately started getting a lot more experience and started, you know, understand how to like, you know, value what we were bringing to the table when we were collaborating with these brands.

[00:04:43] And so, as you mentioned, you know, have done, you know, hundreds and hundreds of deals today.

[00:04:49] But I also, back in 2015, decided to start an influencer marketing agency.

[00:04:54] And this is really where a lot of my perspective comes from when I educate creators, because I started getting in the rooms, in the boardrooms with these big brands and these big advertisers and helping them decide how to allocate not just, let's say, 5K or 10K to a creator.

[00:05:09] But now it's like a million dollars or 500K across, you know, 50 creators or 100 creators.

[00:05:15] What's the platform strategy?

[00:05:16] Like all this stuff.

[00:05:17] And so I really started getting this perspective also interacting with all of these influencers and creators and messaging them and say, hey, this brand over here wants to work with you.

[00:05:26] And seeing so much just unprofessionalism and lack of communication and like just a lot of mistakes being made.

[00:05:35] And so these are the two kind of Jekyll and Hyde's of my personality.

[00:05:38] I've been a creator in the trenches for many years, but also have been in, you know, running and ran an agency for many years.

[00:05:44] And so this is, we can talk about the education stuff, but like this is really what my perspective comes from is seeing all the mistakes that were being made.

[00:05:52] Very, very interesting.

[00:05:53] I feel like you're one of those unique specimens that have the business skills, you know, to negotiate.

[00:06:00] But at the same time, you are extremely creative and you can do all that side as well on the creative side of things, which is, I feel, is a rare sight.

[00:06:10] You don't really come across many creators that are extremely passionate about the business side of things.

[00:06:17] Yeah, and I'm really handsome and humble.

[00:06:19] That's perfect.

[00:06:21] There we go.

[00:06:21] The perfect trifecta.

[00:06:23] Perfect trifecta.

[00:06:24] I can only imagine your wife and the guests, that's right.

[00:06:28] That's the man I married.

[00:06:30] I pray for days where I can have this confidence.

[00:06:34] I just get a big eye roll from Katie, you know, every time I say that, you know, she keeps saying, but you are not funny.

[00:06:41] Well, guess what, Katie?

[00:06:42] We're laughing here, you know?

[00:06:45] But, I mean, that's an incredible story, right?

[00:06:48] And for a lot of people, you know, in our studio, they come in, right?

[00:06:51] And the first thing that they ask, obviously, as they're interested to produce a podcast and they're asking these questions is like, you know, how do we monetize, right?

[00:06:58] And obviously, on our side, we are, you know, our business, the core business is a production agency.

[00:07:03] We have a fractional content team that comes in.

[00:07:05] So, immediately, our podcast, when we launched it, was directly related to that.

[00:07:09] We're like, we're actually going to talk to the decision makers.

[00:07:11] We're going to create content around that, but at the same time, it's a direct line to that conversation that can bring an opportunity, right?

[00:07:19] But then, you know, we have a huge variety of shows that come here and they might not be a fit for a business conversation on the back end, for example, right?

[00:07:27] They might not be an interview show or a conversation show.

[00:07:29] And it can be very, very intimidating, right?

[00:07:31] So, like a cool case study that we have here is like this religious podcast from Dennis, right?

[00:07:37] And he set it up as a nonprofit organization.

[00:07:40] He went out after his friends in the church and the church is financing the whole podcast.

[00:07:45] And this whole thing kind of continues to grow and grow.

[00:07:47] It's very exciting.

[00:07:48] But for him, it was like a very specific thing.

[00:07:50] And before him, I honestly had no idea.

[00:07:53] We've never dealt with sponsorships before the network came along.

[00:07:56] And even with the network, we don't have those conversations.

[00:07:59] So, what are like to diminish that overwhelm that a lot of creators might have initially, right?

[00:08:06] It's like what are the first steps, the first three steps that people can start looking into when tackling things like this?

[00:08:13] Yeah.

[00:08:14] So, I think the biggest myth is that the primary thing that brands or companies care about is your reach or your listeners or your download numbers or whatever.

[00:08:24] This is what most people are fixated on.

[00:08:26] And it's probably the most common question I get is like how many subscribers, how many followers, how many listeners do I need to be able to like start reaching out to a brand?

[00:08:34] And I'll just say right out the gate is BS.

[00:08:37] Like there are a lot of brands that, yes, there are some brands that care about that.

[00:08:42] If that's what you're leading with, if you say, oh, I get 10,000, you know, listens per episode or here's my demographics or blah, blah, blah.

[00:08:49] Then you're basically leading the witness.

[00:08:51] You're saying, okay, please commodify me, brand.

[00:08:55] I'm just like every other creator, every other podcaster that reaches out.

[00:08:59] All you should care about is my listenership.

[00:09:02] And so, what I teach creators is that don't lead with that because there's a lot of other – there's three – basically three campaign goal types that brands care about when they collaborate with a brand.

[00:09:13] The first one is actually awareness, right?

[00:09:16] So, the primary reason that they want to collaborate with you is just to spread the word.

[00:09:20] Maybe it's a new product launch.

[00:09:21] Maybe they're launching in a new territory.

[00:09:23] They were previously only in the UK.

[00:09:25] Now they're in the US.

[00:09:26] And then the next campaign goal type is what I call repurposing.

[00:09:31] So, the primary reason that a brand wants to collaborate with you is because they want to take your content and use it in other ways.

[00:09:38] They want to embed it on their website.

[00:09:40] They want to put it on an e-commerce platform.

[00:09:42] They want to run paid advertising with it.

[00:09:44] And then the final campaign goal type is conversion, right, where it's driving sales or app downloads or trial signups for a software program or whatever.

[00:09:52] And so, it's so important to understand what the brand is trying to accomplish because if you're leading the witness by saying views, downloads, like here's my demographics, then you're telling the brand, okay, well, this is what you should care about.

[00:10:08] When in reality, the brand is going to get this pitch inbound from you and they're like, wait, hold on a second here.

[00:10:12] We actually don't care about that right now.

[00:10:15] Yeah, it's not in alignment with what we're trying to accomplish.

[00:10:18] And so, this is the first place.

[00:10:20] I put my hand on people's shoulders and be like, look, you have to understand this because your pitches are going to fall on deaf ears unless you can speak their language.

[00:10:28] Yeah.

[00:10:29] Yeah.

[00:10:29] Something I heard you talk about was pretty much taking the role of a consultant when you're talking to these brands, right?

[00:10:36] And I feel, again, we personally don't have that much experience besides our experience with HubSpot.

[00:10:42] But I feel like it's a space where a lot of people are very passive, right?

[00:10:47] They are just kind of like waiting for brands to reach out to them, to notice them, which I feel like it's going to be extremely difficult, right?

[00:10:55] At that point, you already need to be very, very big.

[00:10:58] So, there's definitely need to be some sort of proactiveness into reaching out.

[00:11:02] And then there's a special way, right, to intrigue these brands, I'm guessing, right, to cause curiosity, build a relationship, and also find out exactly what is it, what they want.

[00:11:13] So, can you dive a little bit deeper into that?

[00:11:15] Because I think it's going to be extremely helpful for, especially for people that might not have big followings, like you just mentioned right now, right?

[00:11:21] You don't need followers to get a sponsorship.

[00:11:25] Yeah.

[00:11:26] So, what I like to talk about is what I call a sponsorship continuum, meaning that what you pitch to a brand or a company has to change based on where you're at in your creator journey.

[00:11:39] So, if you are in the very beginning and you're still trying to find your footing and try to understand maybe you're only getting a couple hundred downloads on your podcast or views on your videos or whatever,

[00:11:49] if you were to reach out and pitch a brand, hey, let me talk about you on my podcast or let me talk about you on my YouTube channel or something,

[00:11:57] that's likely not going to move the needle for them, right?

[00:11:59] Because your footprint, your viewership is not very large.

[00:12:03] And so, the thrust of your pitch should probably be something more like, hey, I audited your social presence.

[00:12:11] And I think there's a lot of other ways in which we could be telling your brand story in a more compelling way.

[00:12:17] Let me make some content for you.

[00:12:20] And, hey, go take a look at my podcast or my YouTube channel because that is my portfolio.

[00:12:27] So, it's not, hey, let me talk about you on my platform.

[00:12:31] And so, this is the very beginning of the continuum.

[00:12:33] And then, yes, let's say that you do start growing and you are starting to get, let's say, thousands of views or listens on your podcast or your YouTube channel.

[00:12:42] Yeah, maybe now the pitch is more of like a hybrid where I'm going to make some content for you.

[00:12:46] I'm going to talk, yeah, I am going to talk about you on my platform now because it's beginning to be more meaningful.

[00:12:51] And then, now, okay, you do achieve some scale now.

[00:12:54] You're getting tens of thousands of views or listens or whatever.

[00:12:57] Yeah, maybe now it's very meaningful to talk about a brand exclusively on your platform.

[00:13:01] And so, this is what I like to, this is, I like to talk about this continuum because it gives people the permission to realize like,

[00:13:08] oh, I actually don't need to wait until I get 10,000 followers or 10,000, you know, average downloads.

[00:13:13] It's like, I can actually provide a lot of value to a brand today.

[00:13:16] Let me go out and pitch them now.

[00:13:18] Yeah.

[00:13:18] So, how do you find who to pitch?

[00:13:21] Like, usually what are the people in the roles of the decision makers?

[00:13:25] Because I feel like there could be a little bit of confusion there.

[00:13:27] They might go for, I don't know, CMO.

[00:13:30] So, obviously it depends on how big a company is that you want to talk about.

[00:13:34] But, for example, when you were kind of like working on the agency and you were that liaison between the influencers and the big companies,

[00:13:41] who were you mainly talking to?

[00:13:45] Okay.

[00:13:45] So, we can talk about that.

[00:13:46] But can I take a step back here?

[00:13:48] 100%.

[00:13:48] Because this is a mistake I think a lot of people make, which is they say, okay, I'm going to go out there.

[00:13:52] I'm going to pitch some sponsors and I'm going to go after the brands that I already love and use.

[00:13:56] Right?

[00:13:56] I'm going to go pitch, you know, Transistor or Castos or whatever podcast platform I use.

[00:14:03] That's perfect.

[00:14:03] I talk about podcasts a lot on content is profit.

[00:14:06] I'm going to go pitch that.

[00:14:07] Right?

[00:14:07] And so, it's like this is what most people think about is the shoe-in sponsors.

[00:14:12] And the exercise that all creators need to do when they're trying to figure out who would be the perfect sponsor for them is what I call an audience-first offer survey.

[00:14:24] Okay?

[00:14:25] And what this is is actually a psychographic survey that you send out to your audience where you ask them the following questions.

[00:14:34] You say, hey, I want to learn more about you, audience.

[00:14:37] Yeah, I have the demographics of whatever platform I'm on.

[00:14:40] But I want to know more.

[00:14:41] I want to get some more colorful texture about who you are.

[00:14:44] I want to understand, you know, what are your jobs?

[00:14:46] Are you married?

[00:14:47] Do you have kids?

[00:14:48] You know, how are you interacting with my content?

[00:14:50] Are you in line at Starbucks, you know, scrolling, you know, my feed for two minutes?

[00:14:54] Are you sitting down every Sunday and binging three hours of my content, catching up on it?

[00:14:59] What products and services do you wish that I offered that I don't?

[00:15:03] What brands and products and services are you using and loving right now?

[00:15:07] Are there other creators or peers in our industry that you'd love to see me collaborate with and why?

[00:15:13] Right?

[00:15:14] And so when you start asking this information, you get some really interesting insights here.

[00:15:19] The first one is, you know, brands and products and services.

[00:15:22] Oh, wow.

[00:15:23] My people are saying that they want this course for me or this newsletter for me or this other thing that they would actually pay for.

[00:15:29] Number one, that's interesting.

[00:15:30] So your own products, right?

[00:15:32] Direct monetization.

[00:15:33] Then the sponsor thing is like, oh, I actually didn't realize there was this cohort of my audience that is already using this, you know, tool over here that's totally unrelated to my content.

[00:15:43] But so, so for example, you guys work with like a lot of, you know, creators, small business owners, people who are trying to make a name for themselves with content.

[00:15:50] Like what, what happens if you send that survey out to your audience and people are like, oh man, I'm really struggling with, you know, bookkeeping or keeping my, you know, understanding if I need to incorporate or understanding, you know, how I can, you know, expense stuff around tax time.

[00:16:06] Like that's not a super obvious like sponsor for you guys, but you're like, oh wait, like, you know, 50% of my, of our respondents says that they're having a problem with this.

[00:16:15] Let's go out and pitch, you know, QuickBooks or FreshBooks or something and say, hey, this is the persona of our audience.

[00:16:23] I actually would, we'd love to expose our full audience to your solution, right?

[00:16:28] And so, so this is the sponsor thing.

[00:16:29] And then that last thing is what I call alliances, right?

[00:16:32] So it's like, there's other people in the industry of products that they offer, coaching courses, this type of thing that you guys are never going to offer, right?

[00:16:40] But it actually serves your audience.

[00:16:42] And so this whole kind of audience first offers mindset is so critical because now you have a holistic picture of how you can actually serve your audience.

[00:16:50] And so this is, this is the best way to figure out what types of sponsors to pitch because it's not about you.

[00:16:55] It's about your audience.

[00:16:56] I, I'm in awe and I love this because I remember being in a conference and there was a speaker on stage once and they built this incredible company mainly for women.

[00:17:06] And, uh, their entire product offering, their one rule was we have to ask our audience first before we actually go develop the thing.

[00:17:13] And, uh, I think they sold for a hundred million after, you know, a few years of, of executing this.

[00:17:19] But they were like, if our audience is not asking for it, we're not going to build it or create and whatever.

[00:17:23] And, uh, and it was a libel moment for me at that point.

[00:17:27] We were like, well, it actually makes so much sense, right?

[00:17:29] I try to push this thing that maybe, you know, because, you know, we're in the weeds or we're creating it or we experience it every single day.

[00:17:36] It doesn't mean that the people that might listen to our message might be having that same problem.

[00:17:40] You know, I need, like you said, like it's same with the business, but also, uh, you don't have to do that, right?

[00:17:45] There's all the companies that you can, uh, tag team this and, uh, and put it together.

[00:17:50] Yeah. So I, I love this, uh, it's a similar approach and now in my head, everything is kind of coming together, right?

[00:17:54] It's like basically, you know, it's what Hospa is doing, you know, with us, the community, the people that we help, right?

[00:18:00] They obviously are a tech company and they want their message to be heard and hopefully provide a solution for, for the people that are listening and interacting with, with us.

[00:18:09] Um, now following on that, right?

[00:18:11] Like let's say you do your survey, you identify the problems.

[00:18:14] You're like, perfect.

[00:18:14] Like I have this list of people that I can reach out to.

[00:18:17] How do you then, uh, catalog your value as a creator, right?

[00:18:22] Cause obviously a lot of people like their first things like, well, I, if they want to go full-time creator, like I want to make a living out of this, right?

[00:18:28] Obviously, you know, you might have your own bills, your own thing, your own targets on, on how much, uh, do you need every single month, every single year, but also as a business, right?

[00:18:36] How do you, how do you then value that?

[00:18:37] Right.

[00:18:38] And then have that conversation with maybe brands that might be more experienced than you at that point of having these conversations.

[00:18:45] Yeah.

[00:18:46] So, um, Fonzie, I am going to get back to your question around how do you, who do you reach out to?

[00:18:51] It's okay.

[00:18:52] It's okay.

[00:18:53] If you don't, we can just ignore Fonzie.

[00:18:55] Yeah.

[00:18:56] Yeah.

[00:18:57] Yeah.

[00:18:57] Okay.

[00:18:58] Let me, let me just, let me just use the sound.

[00:18:59] Yes.

[00:19:02] Thank you, Justin.

[00:19:03] I will be clipping this and sending it to his wife.

[00:19:06] That's it.

[00:19:09] Okay.

[00:19:09] Okay.

[00:19:10] Okay.

[00:19:10] Okay.

[00:19:10] So, um, I have a really simple, um, uh, exercise, uh, about this to kind of give yourself permission to real, to take the pressure off.

[00:19:19] Um, because it's not about you.

[00:19:23] That's, that's what I want everyone to hear.

[00:19:25] It's not about you when it comes to reaching out and pitching a brand.

[00:19:28] A lot of people get into this imposter syndrome state because they think, oh, I have to do this dog and pony show to convince a brand or a company that I'm worthy of their, you know, collaboration or their money or whatever.

[00:19:41] And it has nothing to do with you.

[00:19:42] It has, you know what it has everything to do with helping the brand accomplish their business objectives.

[00:19:49] That's it.

[00:19:50] And so your task now becomes, instead of doing the dog and pony show is research.

[00:19:55] What are they posting on social media?

[00:19:57] What does it seem like is important to them?

[00:19:59] Go and look up their VP of marketing or the people on their marketing, uh, you know, team on LinkedIn.

[00:20:04] What are they posting on LinkedIn?

[00:20:05] What kind of press releases are they sending out?

[00:20:08] Let's go look at their job board and see what types of positions they're recruiting for.

[00:20:12] Oh, they're looking for a social media manager or a content marketing person.

[00:20:15] That's interesting.

[00:20:16] Let me look at what they're looking for that person to do.

[00:20:18] And then you use that to develop this colorful picture of what it seems like they're trying to accomplish in 2024 or 2025 or whatever it is.

[00:20:28] And so when you reach out to them and say, Hey, I would love to collaborate with you.

[00:20:33] Instead of saying like, Oh, my name is Justin.

[00:20:36] I get this many fall, you know, views on my videos or listens on my podcast.

[00:20:40] I've got this demographics.

[00:20:41] That's an instant delete on that email because the brand doesn't know who you, who you are.

[00:20:45] They don't care.

[00:20:46] Uh, they just ghosted you or rejected you.

[00:20:49] But if you instead say, Hey, I saw that you are trying to, you know, spread awareness of this new feature on your product, uh, based on this, you know, uh, fireside chat that I saw your, heard your VP of marketing talking about it South by Southwest.

[00:21:04] I also am talking about that with my audience.

[00:21:07] Here's a link to like, you know, exactly where I illustrate that my audience has affinity for this goal that you have.

[00:21:13] I would love to help spread the word about this in the following ways.

[00:21:15] I can do 10 podcast ad reads.

[00:21:17] I can do some tech talks.

[00:21:19] I can do some YouTube videos.

[00:21:20] I can give you the rights to repurpose that content for three months.

[00:21:23] Are you free on Thursday at 10 AM to talk about it?

[00:21:25] Right.

[00:21:26] And so it's no longer about you.

[00:21:28] It's about saying, Hey, I saw that you're trying to do this.

[00:21:31] It's a, it's a positioning exercise.

[00:21:32] You have this problem brand sponsoring me will help you solve that problem.

[00:21:38] So it's this real unlock for a lot of people when they realize that, wow, it's actually very easy to illustrate the value that I can have.

[00:21:45] The other, the other brilliant thing about this is that brands and companies don't have buckets of piles of money laying around to pay and sponsor random creators or influencers that reach out.

[00:21:56] You know what they do have money for their own initiatives.

[00:21:59] They have budgets for their own initiatives.

[00:22:01] So that, that's the whole unlock here is like realizing that it's not complicated.

[00:22:05] You just have to do a little bit of sleuthing.

[00:22:07] Yeah, absolutely.

[00:22:08] I think you're going to answer my, my question in there as well by, you know, going and searching for the VPs.

[00:22:13] Like what are some of the positions that they're looking for and whatnot?

[00:22:17] But just to confirm, are those mainly the people you, you kind of like search to talk to?

[00:22:23] So yes and no.

[00:22:24] So the titles change depending on the scale of the organization, right?

[00:22:29] So yeah, if it's a, if it's a small mom and pop shop and there's 10 employees there, you look it up on LinkedIn.

[00:22:34] There's probably only going to be one marketing person at that company.

[00:22:38] The head of marketing or the director of marketing, that's probably the person doing all the things.

[00:22:42] But as a company gets larger, then they start to, you know, develop different, you know, competencies within compartmentalizing their siloed across different departments.

[00:22:54] So yeah, like a lot of, especially consumer brands and even B2B companies now have influencer marketing managers or partnership marketing managers, right?

[00:23:03] And so those are the types of titles that you'd want to target.

[00:23:06] But then once you get very large and you get to a certain level of scale, now the company probably hires an agency, a PR agency, maybe even a media agency, influencer marketing agency to handle a lot of these types of activations, especially if it's a large part of their marketing strategy.

[00:23:21] And so, yeah, it does definitely change depending on the scale of the organization, but that's kind of how I think about it.

[00:23:27] Yeah.

[00:23:27] So I heard you talk about kind of like a hybrid model, right?

[00:23:32] Of that being your favorite, meaning the company pays you some sort of base compensation, right?

[00:23:39] For the work that you're putting in, as well as maybe some affiliate deals, you know, through the conversions that you might be getting for that brand.

[00:23:48] Now, I want to add this to this question.

[00:23:52] I have these hypotheses, right, for a while, and I think you're the perfect person to throw it out there, kind of like spaghetti to a wall, see if it sticks, you know?

[00:24:01] All right.

[00:24:01] I called it the growth partnership.

[00:24:05] Well, actually, I got to work on the name, clearly.

[00:24:08] I thought I had a third word in there.

[00:24:12] Let's workshop it.

[00:24:13] But, yeah, let's workshop it that.

[00:24:15] But the hypothesis pretty much, and this came actually when we were at Podcast Movement, right?

[00:24:19] And we saw a lot of brands out there, and we saw a lot of people talking, and I was like, you know what?

[00:24:23] For somebody that might not have a big social media audience, but we want to grow that audience, right?

[00:24:31] We can.

[00:24:32] There's obviously multiple ways, collaborations, but we also want to get sponsorships.

[00:24:36] So is there a way to potentially get them, you know, sell them on the awareness, get them to pay for the ad budget in a sense, right?

[00:24:48] And then it's a win-win situation because we're creating content for them, putting money behind it to reach new audiences.

[00:24:55] And those new audiences are, you know, getting awareness on the brand and then following as well as us as creators.

[00:25:02] And hopefully on that, we get caught maybe for, you know, that base payment that you could say.

[00:25:09] And when you talked about the hybrid model, my mind went to this idea that I had a while back.

[00:25:15] Have you seen anything like that done before?

[00:25:19] Maybe there's a better way, right, that you've experienced throughout your years.

[00:25:24] I mean, I think that every brand is different.

[00:25:27] Like every brand is going to get excited.

[00:25:29] Like, you know, I've seen this.

[00:25:30] I can't even tell you how many times I've seen this where the CEO of a company will just decide that, hey, content marketing, influencer marketing, we have to do this.

[00:25:41] They went to inbound or they went to podcast movement or they went to some industry trade show.

[00:25:46] And they heard someone speak about how important content is, how content is profit.

[00:25:51] Right.

[00:25:51] And they were like and they said, we need to do this.

[00:25:54] And so they arrive back at the office and they send out a mandate to their marketing team that like, hey, this is the thing we need to do now.

[00:26:01] And so like at that point, you know, like it just depends on like what the priorities are for the organization at any given time.

[00:26:13] And so what I say is that, yeah, it could probably work for the right brand or the right company at the right time if it's a priority for the organization.

[00:26:22] But you're not going to know that until you start becoming a detective.

[00:26:25] So when you start doing the research and you see what's going on, you hear them speak or you hear something.

[00:26:31] And then when you get your foot in the door and you're on an initial discovery call with that company and you start asking these questions, what's your content strategy brand?

[00:26:40] What's your, you know, partnership or influencer strategy?

[00:26:43] What's your right?

[00:26:43] And you just kind of start pulling the thread rather than sitting up there and talking about you and having it be this big ego stroke.

[00:26:49] You check that at the door and you say, tell me, like, let's make this a discovery.

[00:26:54] You tell me everything that I need to know.

[00:26:57] And then your solution is going to be bespoke for every brand.

[00:27:03] So one brand that you have a call with may say, oh, we just want to be featured on your podcast.

[00:27:07] Yeah, we just want that awareness.

[00:27:09] Another brand may say, we have no idea what we're doing.

[00:27:13] We really wanted our podcast for ourself, for our business.

[00:27:15] We want to do this.

[00:27:16] We want to stand up our YouTube channel.

[00:27:18] We want to do this.

[00:27:18] Can you do that too?

[00:27:20] They may not even want to be featured on your podcast, right?

[00:27:23] Because that's not their goal.

[00:27:25] And so I really try to pound this into people's heads that it's not about you.

[00:27:29] It's not about just like, oh, yeah, I'm going to put this into my ad inventory.

[00:27:34] No, it's like you have to serve the brand depending on what their goals are because that's how you're going to make so much more money.

[00:27:41] This is how you're going to make 10 times the amount of money on your sponsorship strategy when you stop thinking about it as just inventory.

[00:27:48] I love it.

[00:27:49] I like that point of view.

[00:27:51] I love that you keep coming back to that.

[00:27:52] It's kind of that principle, right?

[00:27:55] It's not about you.

[00:27:56] It's about them.

[00:27:57] This is step number one, right?

[00:27:59] Immediately my mind went kind of to this thought process of, well, what if you create this playbook or different type of playbooks that you could present to organizations depending on the type of problems that they have and they're considering, right?

[00:28:14] So if they have, if you talk to somebody, you know, you take the role of a detective and they do say, well, we do have an awareness challenge and, you know, we're looking for people, spread awareness.

[00:28:24] We have a budget.

[00:28:25] You're like, oh, cool.

[00:28:26] Then here is the growth partnership model.

[00:28:29] All right.

[00:28:29] We'll work on that.

[00:28:30] Right.

[00:28:31] And then you're like, hey, look, maybe that is an option, you know, that we can do.

[00:28:35] But now you are tying that solution after being the detective first.

[00:28:39] I like that.

[00:28:40] A hundred percent.

[00:28:41] And this is what will happen is that you will start developing this private repository of proposals that you just kind of cut and paste the right slides depending on what the brand's problem is.

[00:28:54] Right.

[00:28:54] And so rather than sending out a partnership deck, that's like this boilerplate media kid or whatever, like, here you go.

[00:29:00] This is like how we work with every brand.

[00:29:02] Pick option A, B, C, D, E.

[00:29:04] No, it's like, here's, this is the customized solution based on what you told me.

[00:29:10] Like one thing I talk about in my, in my Brand Deal Wizard program is like developing these proposals where the first slide is what we heard.

[00:29:18] These are the goals that you said you have.

[00:29:20] Goal one, goal two, goal three, go four.

[00:29:22] And you go through the proposal and you're literally tying everything that you're proposing to their goals.

[00:29:29] So they said, oh, you said awareness or content marketing is your goal.

[00:29:33] Well, package one, that's going to be the package that you want to pick if that's the goal that you want to accomplish.

[00:29:38] And because now rather than being like, which sponsorship package do you want to pick?

[00:29:43] It's, hey, pick this specific one so that you can, but you know, by the end of this, you're going to accomplish that goal.

[00:29:49] Because remember, they have to go, they have, they're accountable to their, you know, superiors or their boss or their client if it's an agency.

[00:29:57] And so if they can bring this proposal back to them and say, hey, this, this, you know, Luis and Fonzie are saying that if we pay them $50,000 or $25,000, we're going to accomplish this goal we have.

[00:30:07] You're going to instantly stand out from all these other people that they're talking to because none of those people are making those promises or those guarantees or those tying that.

[00:30:15] And again, it's like, it's so, so important to help them, you know, realize that these sponsorship dollars are not going to be the other thing too.

[00:30:24] Sorry, I'm going all these rabbit holes.

[00:30:26] I love it.

[00:30:26] What, what are the, what, what are their alternatives to influencer marketing?

[00:30:31] This is what they're thinking is like, okay, we could spend 50K here or we could go spend 50K on Facebook ads.

[00:30:37] And we know that, you know, if we spend, you know, 10K on Facebook ads, we know that the return on ad spend to that for the last five years has been two or three X or something, right?

[00:30:50] We know that, right?

[00:30:51] And so they're thinking about the same thing here.

[00:30:54] They're thinking, okay, well, why should we spend 25 or 50K on this partnership here?

[00:30:58] We don't have that same level of certainty with that spend.

[00:31:02] And so your goal should be helping them understand, no, no, you actually do have that certainty here.

[00:31:08] It's different because there's content at play.

[00:31:10] That's not free.

[00:31:11] Like there, there's a lot of different aspects here, but like you can have the same level of, of goal certainty, you know, through, through partnerships.

[00:31:19] Yeah.

[00:31:19] Yeah.

[00:31:20] I love that at the base of everything is serving, right?

[00:31:24] At the end of the day, serving education at the end of the day.

[00:31:27] I mean, nobody knows your content better than you.

[00:31:29] That's the other thing, right?

[00:31:30] Like sometimes, you know, as creators, you're creating your, your thing.

[00:31:33] You've done it for, for a bunch of time.

[00:31:35] You know, the people that follow you, you have these conversations every single day.

[00:31:39] And it's also, you know, trusting yourself that, that you know that, that you can actually go ahead and have that conversation.

[00:31:44] And then when the focus shifts on like, actually, here's how we can help you with your specific problems.

[00:31:49] I love it.

[00:31:49] I mean, the, for, for us personally on the business side, everything changed once we started listening to that, right?

[00:31:55] Like before the, the content fractional team agency that, that we started, we had seven different things, right?

[00:32:00] And we like, you know, and do this and do that.

[00:32:02] And, and I think going back, as you were explaining it, that was like a similar process that we did, right?

[00:32:07] We have this very customizable offers as an agency or a service or freelancers at the time, right?

[00:32:13] And then they'll be like, okay, this is a specific one for you.

[00:32:15] And then we're like, oh, we charge way too little for that.

[00:32:18] And then the next time we'll be like, okay, we raised the price, right?

[00:32:25] The one that most people were like after, right?

[00:32:27] And then that evolved into the different things.

[00:32:30] So I'm going through my head, this process of sponsorship is very similar at the end of the day, right?

[00:32:34] And, and it focused on serving that client or partner or brand that you, that you're talking to.

[00:32:40] I love this.

[00:32:42] It in my head is simplifying the process.

[00:32:45] And I'm hoping by walking through this, a lot of people listening today are going through the same process.

[00:32:51] If they have a business or if they have a product or a situation that they've done similar things.

[00:32:56] And at the end of the day, it's like, what's in it for them, right?

[00:32:58] It's just like the content.

[00:32:59] It's like, is my hook, what's in it for them?

[00:33:01] In my content, what's in it for them?

[00:33:02] Are we providing a win for them?

[00:33:04] Are they, you know, moving to the next step?

[00:33:06] I freaking love this.

[00:33:09] Yeah, Justin, I do want to do a little transition here.

[00:33:12] I love everything we've talked about sponsorships, right?

[00:33:14] I mean, the biggest myth companies, you know, that in reality, not all brands just care about the followers and all that stuff, right?

[00:33:23] The three types of you had a specific name for this kind of like gold content awareness that they embedded, the conversion, the sponsorship continuum.

[00:33:32] That was pretty good.

[00:33:33] How to figure out who'd be your perfect sponsor, right?

[00:33:36] Psychographic survey, audience first offer mindset, lots of lots of gold.

[00:33:41] But like I mentioned at the very beginning, one of the things that really caught my attention about you was your hooks.

[00:33:46] Man, you are good.

[00:33:48] Your hooks are amazing.

[00:33:50] And, you know, something that I've learned from Ali Abdaal was he says he spends an asymmetric amount of effort throughout the production of his content,

[00:33:59] meaning the parts that usually get the most views he's going to invest the most effort in, which is usually the first couple of seconds, right?

[00:34:06] And the title, the thumbnail, the first 30 seconds, one minute, the hook.

[00:34:10] And let me tell you, I can tell nowadays who are going to be the creators.

[00:34:16] As soon as I start watching their latest, you know, content, I'm like, this creator is going to keep rising through the ranks because of their hook and the amount of effort and intention that they put into the beginning of their videos.

[00:34:30] You are one of those, my friend.

[00:34:32] And I'm excited to learn more about do you have a process on how do you create these hooks, right?

[00:34:40] Maybe what are some takeaways that people that are listening to this today can add that to their repertoire of content creation arsenal, right?

[00:34:49] And then it's also going to help them when they get to pitch a sponsor, right?

[00:34:53] When they get to have that conversation, they're going to go and look at their content.

[00:34:56] They're going to see, well, they got better hooks.

[00:34:58] They got really hooks, which is going to help them overall, right, with their retention and getting this cover and all that stuff.

[00:35:04] So what are maybe some key takeaways in there?

[00:35:07] All right.

[00:35:08] So I appreciate that.

[00:35:10] Thank you.

[00:35:11] Okay.

[00:35:12] I got two things to talk about here.

[00:35:13] The first one is that I script everything.

[00:35:18] Like I have not my, so I like when I do live streams and stuff like that, obviously I can't script that.

[00:35:23] But like all of my long form content, all my short form content, I heavily script it because like I think that it's, it's, I know myself.

[00:35:33] And I sit, if I sit down in front of a camera, I'm just going to start rambling and I'm not, you know, I want to eliminate as much fluff as possible.

[00:35:42] And I want to make sure that I'm able to deliver the message that I'm able to in the shortest amount of time.

[00:35:48] And just again, provide value for as quickly as possible for the people who are going to click on that YouTube video or that TikTok or whatever it is.

[00:35:56] And so scripting to me, a lot of people I know are not like right now.

[00:35:59] I'm looking straight into a teleprompter right now.

[00:36:01] I have a teleprompter with my camera.

[00:36:03] And so I'm looking directly at you guys.

[00:36:05] I'm not looking like slightly below my screen.

[00:36:07] So when I have the teleprompter, I have my script and I'm looking at it and I'm filming that.

[00:36:11] I'm shameless about it.

[00:36:12] I talk about it all the time.

[00:36:13] Yeah.

[00:36:13] Like I believe like putting the effort in to actually like be intentional about the words that you use and all that stuff too makes a big difference when it comes to hooks and content and all that stuff too.

[00:36:23] The other, the second thing I would say is that I've spoken with a lot of people who feel that hooks are dirty.

[00:36:28] They feel as though like, I don't want to do all that.

[00:36:33] Like, you know, have tried to be, you know, like click bait or like say something crazy just to like pull someone in.

[00:36:39] And the way that I always, I've always looked at it is that no, it's actually my goal at the end of the day is impact, is service.

[00:36:46] I want to help people learn about sponsorships.

[00:36:48] And so if that means that I have to get through people's, the tough exterior that people have or the doubt, the disbelief that they have around this.

[00:36:58] If a hook is going to help me cut through that, I'm going to play that game all day long.

[00:37:03] And so for, for people who are, who are feeling as though like, I don't want to play that game.

[00:37:07] I don't want to do the short form content, TikTok.

[00:37:09] I don't want to, I don't want to dance on the internet.

[00:37:11] Like I don't want to do all that.

[00:37:11] It's like, come on, like get over yourself.

[00:37:13] Like if you want to have impact, like this is what you have to do.

[00:37:17] If that's, if your audience is responding to that type of content, figure out creative ways to get through to them.

[00:37:22] And so I just think that like not taking yourself too serious.

[00:37:25] And that's the other thing, not taking, I just do not take myself seriously.

[00:37:28] Like I am like the most, um, like I'll, I'll be honest.

[00:37:33] Like when I, when I started my content journey, I very much did feel like I needed to be professional and buttoned up and like, you know, talk a little bit more formally.

[00:37:42] If you go back and look at some of the earliest videos on my creator wizard channel, I'm like super formal and I'm like sitting there and like this type of thing.

[00:37:49] Right.

[00:37:49] And now I'm just like crazy.

[00:37:50] I'm like filming the B roll with my cats and like just being weird.

[00:37:55] And like, you know, I think people just resonate with just like being uniquely you.

[00:37:59] Yeah.

[00:37:59] Yeah.

[00:38:00] It adds us as a, as a magnet, right.

[00:38:02] For the people that you really want to want to attract.

[00:38:04] And, you know, you, we obviously deal with a lot of people that are maybe at that uptight face in, you know, in their content creation might be the first time that actually in front of a camera, you know, we've have to sit down with them a couple of times.

[00:38:16] Like, Hey, let's do this again.

[00:38:17] And let's do this way.

[00:38:18] And, uh, you know, take a deep breath.

[00:38:20] Let's go walk.

[00:38:20] Like think about something nice and all this, these things, uh, like to get them through to be more them.

[00:38:26] Right.

[00:38:27] And I remember, uh, for us, that was very similar.

[00:38:29] And, and it got to a moment where we're like, our, we call this current moment, you know, where we're like, screw it.

[00:38:34] You know what?

[00:38:35] It is what it is.

[00:38:36] You know, we're doing the hair.

[00:38:37] We have a hoodie.

[00:38:38] We'll jump in here.

[00:38:39] We'll do it.

[00:38:39] And that was like the moment where we unlocked consistency.

[00:38:42] Right.

[00:38:43] Because it was, we just remove a ton of friction, mental friction, mental weights that we had.

[00:38:48] And we knew by conquering consistency, then we can start getting better.

[00:38:52] Right.

[00:38:52] Because you put in the reps and you do that.

[00:38:54] And obviously you've done it for, for many years.

[00:38:56] Right.

[00:38:56] So now you have your style.

[00:38:58] You could, you know, for flow, you can jump on this interview and be like, Hey, let's talk about all this.

[00:39:01] Right.

[00:39:02] Uh, and, uh, but I'm with you, right.

[00:39:04] It's identifying those friction points in your own process and be like, okay, how can I remove it?

[00:39:10] So I can actually go and operate.

[00:39:12] You mentioned the teleprompter, right?

[00:39:13] That's a tool that maybe a lot of people might be starting thinking.

[00:39:16] And I know that a lot of people are thinking, if I use a teleprompter, I do not know my topic enough.

[00:39:21] I'm like, it's not about that.

[00:39:23] Right.

[00:39:23] It's about so many other things.

[00:39:24] It's like looking at your audience in the eye.

[00:39:27] Right.

[00:39:27] It's about, I'm talking to them and not with somebody else.

[00:39:30] And what you mentioned, like slight, you know, a little bit lower.

[00:39:33] Those are details that matter when you get to, you know, the level that, that you are at the moment.

[00:39:38] So I appreciate you being transparent with all this.

[00:39:40] I will say.

[00:39:41] Yeah.

[00:39:42] Oh, sorry.

[00:39:42] Go ahead, Justin.

[00:39:44] Yeah.

[00:39:44] No, I just wanted to add bookend that with one thing.

[00:39:46] You know, I got off stage.

[00:39:48] I was speaking at a conference recently and someone asked me, how do you seem so natural on stage?

[00:39:53] Like, like, how are you able to like, you know, tell these stories and like just be very kind of on the fly?

[00:39:58] And it seems as though it's kind of supernatural for you.

[00:40:01] And I've, no one had ever asked me that before.

[00:40:03] And so I thought about it.

[00:40:04] And I think the single, if there was a single piece of advice that I could give to anyone about being more natural on camera was live stream.

[00:40:14] I've been live streaming every single week for about three years now.

[00:40:19] And that is a very unique skill set where I don't have, I'm not like you guys, where I don't have like someone to talk to.

[00:40:26] Like I don't have a co-host.

[00:40:28] I feel the same way, Justin.

[00:40:30] Wait, you don't use your cats as co-host?

[00:40:32] Wait, it's not that.

[00:40:33] Well, you know what?

[00:40:34] That would be a good idea.

[00:40:35] I should put them in here when I do it.

[00:40:37] No, but it's like I am, I am the only thing that I'm doing is interacting with the chat.

[00:40:41] Yeah.

[00:40:42] Right.

[00:40:42] And so there are times where no one's asking questions or like I don't really know what to say for the next thing.

[00:40:48] And I just have to kind of get good at being like, oh, and that reminds me, like, let me transition to this next topic.

[00:40:53] And so it's like I've gotten super good at just kind of thinking on the fly about how to, like, that's how I was able to do, you know, this podcast.

[00:41:00] We didn't even have prep.

[00:41:01] I've never met you guys.

[00:41:02] We hopped on and we're like, we're having a great conversation because it's like I'm able because I've been doing it every single week talking about this topic.

[00:41:10] I have so many things to talk about because of this repetitions that I put in just kind of talking by myself in my bedroom, you know, for an hour every week.

[00:41:19] Like, you know, or not my bedroom is an office, but, you know, you know what I mean?

[00:41:23] Yeah.

[00:41:24] It might be the bedroom when the wife gets mad.

[00:41:27] But, you know, Justin, it's funny that you mentioned that about the live because before we actually started the podcast, we had a challenge called the 45 live.

[00:41:37] And it came out from necessity, right?

[00:41:40] And at the same time, we were kind of doing this, the 75 hard.

[00:41:43] So we're like, all right, how do we stay consistent?

[00:41:46] And, you know, we got the inspiration from 75 hard to, hey, let's do a challenge.

[00:41:50] And we created the 45 live, which was go live for 45 days in a row.

[00:41:55] And it was internal.

[00:41:55] It was just me and Fazi.

[00:41:57] Yeah, just the two of us.

[00:41:57] Like, just us.

[00:41:58] And that actually kickstarted a lot of things.

[00:42:00] It kickstarted the podcast.

[00:42:01] It actually led us to some great partnerships, right?

[00:42:06] Because there were some people that weren't commenting, but they were, you know, the silent watchers.

[00:42:10] And that turned into amazing partnerships and opportunities.

[00:42:13] And when we decided to start the podcast, now that you mentioned it, the skill carried.

[00:42:20] We went on the podcast.

[00:42:21] And at first, we're like, you know what?

[00:42:22] To stay consistent, we're going to do the show live.

[00:42:26] Like, we used to do the first, like, 200 episodes.

[00:42:28] We were live every single time.

[00:42:30] That's why we have this animated intro, right?

[00:42:33] We might bring it back.

[00:42:34] Who knows?

[00:42:34] We might bring the lives back.

[00:42:36] We're working on the logistics of the studio right now.

[00:42:38] It's a great way.

[00:42:38] And you really made me consider, should we get all of our clients to do the 45 live challenge as soon as they sign up?

[00:42:47] Because a lot of them, it's very difficult to get them in front of the camera and be, I don't want to say be themselves, but be comfortable, right?

[00:42:56] Just like, be comfortable in front of the camera.

[00:42:59] Like, we're having a conversation.

[00:43:00] They're extremely comfortable.

[00:43:01] And then as soon as we tell them, all right, we're about to start recording.

[00:43:04] And they see the five-second countdown on Riverside.

[00:43:07] They stiffen up.

[00:43:08] They're like, mommies.

[00:43:09] We're like, what happened?

[00:43:10] What is going on?

[00:43:11] They're like this.

[00:43:12] Yeah.

[00:43:12] This is like this.

[00:43:13] It's right.

[00:43:14] Literally.

[00:43:14] And we're like, you are so extroverted.

[00:43:16] As soon as this went on, like, it all went out the window.

[00:43:19] You know what was a crazy experiment that we did once?

[00:43:22] We were in Boise, Idaho.

[00:43:23] And we were in this coffee shop.

[00:43:25] And we decided that that trip that we were going to vlog the experience, right?

[00:43:28] Or I decided that we're going to vlog that experience.

[00:43:31] Once it was like, whatever, you do whatever you want to do.

[00:43:34] But we were running the show.

[00:43:35] I think it was like 300 plus episodes at the time, live, right, with people coming in and

[00:43:39] out, the experience.

[00:43:40] And I remember the first, we were recording on a coffee shop.

[00:43:44] And then we go to a gas station next door.

[00:43:46] And we're going to record the interaction instead of the gas station.

[00:43:49] You know, we have the camera in front of my face.

[00:43:51] And I remember feeling the same way I felt before our first ever interview on the podcast.

[00:43:58] And in my head, I was like, we've done this like 400 plus times plus a 45 life.

[00:44:03] But I'm in a public space with like people that I don't know with this camera in front of

[00:44:07] my face.

[00:44:08] And I remember starting to talk to the camera.

[00:44:10] And then this manager came and was like, you guys can be recording here.

[00:44:13] And we're like, I totally freaked out.

[00:44:15] And I remember, you know, we did an episode on this, on feeling that way.

[00:44:20] And it was a really great exercise to be like, wow, I identify now again.

[00:44:23] I went back to that place.

[00:44:25] And this is another skill that we have to develop at this point.

[00:44:28] And it was super interesting to go to that spot.

[00:44:30] And do you know Pat Flynn?

[00:44:32] Do you know who Pat Flynn is?

[00:44:33] I'm assuming?

[00:44:34] I do, yeah.

[00:44:35] Okay.

[00:44:35] I've been on his podcast, yeah.

[00:44:36] Perfect.

[00:44:36] Okay.

[00:44:37] So before, like I knew him for the podcast inside.

[00:44:40] We have some of his products.

[00:44:41] And what I just recently discovered that he's an avid Pokemon card collector, right?

[00:44:47] I've been getting into Pokemon cards.

[00:44:49] But his live streams on Pokemon cards, like opening the packs is incredible.

[00:44:56] The way that he interacts with the chat.

[00:44:59] And it's not about the product and the thing.

[00:45:00] It was about the whole experience that he's crafting for the audience.

[00:45:03] And by you saying that, it was like, wow, what a great tool for people to start getting into this and putting on the reps.

[00:45:09] He's grabbing a hobby that he loves.

[00:45:11] And then he's shifting his live stream on.

[00:45:14] It's not a business live stream.

[00:45:15] It's like his passion thing.

[00:45:16] So even if you are developing content for your business, what is something around the house, around things that you like that you can start live streaming about and getting those reps?

[00:45:27] And I think it's super interesting because you can always grab things from there and then apply it to your business content.

[00:46:00] Yeah.

[00:46:02] What if they don't respond?

[00:46:04] And so it's been an experience for me to work with a lot of creators who are at the earlier stages of their career and realize that, no, actually getting the repetitions in at the beginning of realizing that.

[00:46:17] Like if a brand doesn't respond or says no to you, what I say, it's not no, it's not yet.

[00:46:25] That's always been my perspective.

[00:46:26] It's like if a brand, unless a brand says, don't ever contact me again, I'm going to call the police.

[00:46:33] Like you should always like that.

[00:46:36] That's a brand that you should be nurturing because it may not be now that they're ready to collaborate with you.

[00:46:42] But in a year when their CEO decides that content is a priority and you happen to reach out again because they're in your monthly nurture, monthly or quarterly nurturing cycle, they're going to be like, oh, I'm so glad you emailed.

[00:46:54] You're top of mind now because, you know, this is a priority for us right now.

[00:46:57] I cannot tell you this is how it happens.

[00:46:59] Like when I tell people, when I sit them down and be like, the point of pitching is not to get a deal.

[00:47:05] The point is to get on their radar so that when they are ready to collaborate with you, you're top of mind.

[00:47:11] That is the whole point of pitching and having it be part of your regular routine as a creator business.

[00:47:17] And people's minds are blown like, oh, wow.

[00:47:19] Like I was getting all like depressed when a brand would be like, no, we're not like we don't have a budget for this right now.

[00:47:25] And I'm like, that doesn't matter.

[00:47:26] Like you're now on their radar.

[00:47:28] Start emailing them every month, every quarter.

[00:47:30] Believe me, in a year, in two years, you're going to work with them.

[00:47:33] Believe me.

[00:47:33] Yeah.

[00:47:34] Wow.

[00:47:34] That's amazing.

[00:47:35] Show up at their office.

[00:47:36] Like, oh, you know, I just bought this extra coffee.

[00:47:39] Yeah, we just got this two dozen donuts randomly.

[00:47:43] Damn, look at that.

[00:47:45] You know, and by the way, click the link in the show notes if you want Lewis's course on stocking.

[00:47:51] Only $5.99 for Cyber Monday.

[00:47:54] $5.99?

[00:47:56] We'll make an even better offer for free.

[00:48:01] Justin, this has been absolutely amazing.

[00:48:04] I am curious before we have one last question that we ask every guest.

[00:48:07] But before that, I'm curious on your live streaming.

[00:48:09] What exactly do you do your live streaming about?

[00:48:13] And then on what platform do you do it?

[00:48:16] Well, it's a live stream all about male modeling.

[00:48:19] Makes sense.

[00:48:19] Makes sense.

[00:48:20] And you do it on your golden speedo, right?

[00:48:22] Sino.

[00:48:26] Holding the cat.

[00:48:28] Sorry.

[00:48:29] Oh, my God.

[00:48:30] I love podcasts like this.

[00:48:34] My live stream is all around sponsorships and brand deal negotiation.

[00:48:38] So I talk all about this very nerdy and very niche topic around working with brands, collaborating.

[00:48:43] It's very interactive.

[00:48:45] People, oh, I've got this brand in my inbox and I want to do this.

[00:48:48] Like, you know, what should I say to them?

[00:48:49] Like this type of thing.

[00:48:49] So I literally just answer people's questions for an hour basically around brand deal strategy.

[00:48:54] Is that inside your community?

[00:48:56] I know you have a circle community or is that live on YouTube?

[00:49:00] Yeah, it's live on.

[00:49:01] I multi-stream across every platform.

[00:49:03] YouTube, LinkedIn, Twitter, et cetera.

[00:49:05] Clarifying?

[00:49:06] No golden speedo.

[00:49:09] No.

[00:49:10] I mean, you can't really see.

[00:49:12] You don't know what I'm wearing below.

[00:49:14] There we go.

[00:49:14] From the waist down.

[00:49:16] No OnlyFans streaming.

[00:49:19] Oh, geez.

[00:49:20] That's awesome.

[00:49:20] I was asking Lee Selfish so I can go and join one of those.

[00:49:23] I would love to catch one of those lives.

[00:49:25] I would love for you guys to come on.

[00:49:26] It would be awesome.

[00:49:27] Yeah, we'll be on the chat right there.

[00:49:30] Justin.

[00:49:30] Please do.

[00:49:31] So last question we ask everyone.

[00:49:33] Usually we ask two, but the reason I'm not asking for the action points is because I think

[00:49:38] this episode is packed with action points.

[00:49:41] Things that you guys can do to move one step closer towards getting that sponsorship for,

[00:49:47] you know, whatever medium it is that you guys are publishing on.

[00:49:50] And but this question is we love this question.

[00:49:56] Where would you be if you didn't publish ever?

[00:50:09] I think I would still be working in medical devices as an engineer.

[00:50:13] I don't think that I would be.

[00:50:15] And actually, I would be there if it were not for my wife, if it were not for my wife,

[00:50:21] having the courage to hit publish on her first YouTube video, because I learned a lot of,

[00:50:27] you know, what it takes to actually have the perseverance to create content from her.

[00:50:33] And so I attribute a lot of my success to her.

[00:50:35] That's awesome.

[00:50:36] That's awesome.

[00:50:37] Thanks for sharing.

[00:50:37] Hopefully that helps somebody that's about to hit publish, you know, to go actually publish it.

[00:50:42] Yeah.

[00:50:43] Justin, it's been an absolute pleasure, man.

[00:50:44] Thanks for coming on.

[00:50:45] Fonzie has been, you know, talking nonstop about your tweets and things.

[00:50:49] And it's such an incredible resource, right?

[00:50:51] We're going to keep this episode not only public, but also as a reference for everybody that comes here

[00:50:56] into the studio that has that question.

[00:50:58] Be like, hey, this is what you need to consume, learn a little bit more, you know, meet Justin.

[00:51:03] And hopefully this is the start of a really cool relationship, man.

[00:51:06] Yeah.

[00:51:06] It's a super honor to have you.

[00:51:08] Yeah.

[00:51:08] How can people connect and stay in touch with you?

[00:51:11] Yeah, sure.

[00:51:12] So probably the best way is my weekly newsletter, creatorwizard.com slash join.

[00:51:18] Probably the main reason you want to join is because I send you paid sponsorship opportunities

[00:51:23] for free on a silver platter.

[00:51:25] I'd be like, hey, these are brands that are currently actively trying to find creators

[00:51:29] to collaborate with.

[00:51:31] And so it's actually a four times weekly newsletter.

[00:51:34] So my newsletter is like one of the biggest parts of my business.

[00:51:37] Actually, I love, you know, being able to send videos and podcasts and all sorts of stuff.

[00:51:42] I have my own podcast we didn't even talk about where it's called Creator Debates, where

[00:51:45] every episode pits two high profile creators against each other.

[00:51:48] It's so good.

[00:51:49] It's so good.

[00:51:51] Thank you, man.

[00:51:52] I appreciate it.

[00:51:52] Yeah.

[00:51:53] So, yeah, creatorwizard.com slash join is the best way to find out everything that's

[00:51:56] going on in my universe.

[00:51:58] Yeah.

[00:51:58] We're going to have to bring you back just to talk exclusive podcasting because I know

[00:52:01] you also have, you started your podcast through some sort of realization there with the ads

[00:52:07] loss and all that stuff that I think is pretty interesting.

[00:52:10] But Justin, man, thank you so much for coming.

[00:52:12] I want to encourage everybody, obviously, listening to join the newsletter.

[00:52:16] Incredible value.

[00:52:17] You're going to learn a lot from Justin.

[00:52:19] Follow him on YouTube, on Twitter.

[00:52:21] He is extremely active in all those platforms.

[00:52:24] Maybe you even want to check out his YouTube channel with his wife, right?

[00:52:27] April Justin TV.

[00:52:28] You're going to see him dress up as a Boy Scout, which is pretty, pretty cool.

[00:52:32] Let me tell you.

[00:52:33] I am an Eagle Scout.

[00:52:34] I am an Eagle Scout.

[00:52:35] There you go.

[00:52:36] Yeah.

[00:52:36] All these things that people don't know about me.

[00:52:39] Yeah.

[00:52:39] I know.

[00:52:40] That's awesome.

[00:52:41] That channel is where you go to learn the secrets.

[00:52:44] Well, I mean, under the Eagle Scout uniform was the gold in the Speedo.

[00:52:51] He has to be there always.

[00:52:52] He has to be there.

[00:52:53] Bring in a poster from there.

[00:52:55] There we go.

[00:52:56] Justin, anything else you want to add before we head out?

[00:53:01] Yeah.

[00:53:01] If I could just give one parting note of encouragement, like I'm just going to cue the Rocky music or

[00:53:08] like the encouraging motivational soundtrack is just like, you can do this.

[00:53:12] Like sponsorships, I believe is for everyone.

[00:53:14] Like it doesn't matter how, what size you are, what niche you're in.

[00:53:18] It doesn't matter if you've never done it before.

[00:53:20] There exists brands and companies out there that you can capably serve.

[00:53:24] And you can actually make a lot of money doing this.

[00:53:27] If you're thinking that, oh, how much could I really make $25 CPM on a podcast?

[00:53:32] No, no, no.

[00:53:32] It's not about CPM.

[00:53:34] It's not about, you know, this couple hundred bucks.

[00:53:37] This brand is like throwing your way.

[00:53:38] No, you can actually make, you know, like you've mentioned at the top, my wife and I've made $4 million in sponsorships.

[00:53:44] And, you know, in the last decade plus.

[00:53:46] And so like it can be a very, very huge and have a very huge impact on your life and your business.

[00:53:52] So give it a shot.

[00:53:53] I love it.

[00:53:53] That's awesome.

[00:53:54] This episode has been full of what we call golden boulders, just like golden nuggets, just way bigger.

[00:53:59] That was absolutely amazing, Justin.

[00:54:01] Thank you so much.

[00:54:02] With that said, guys, thank you so much for tuning to the Contents Profit Podcast.

[00:54:06] Go ahead and follow the show in your favorite podcasting platform and on social media at Biz Bros Co.

[00:54:10] That is right.

[00:54:11] If Justin here help you move one step closer towards closing that sponsorship deal, please make sure you share this episode and leave a five-star review.

[00:54:21] See ya.

[00:54:21] Bye, guys.